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Home >> World-issues >> Demonstrations last weekend

28.03.2011, 20:35 quote

god
Joined: 30 May 2006 Posts: 752
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Really odd - in many countries people went into the streets to demonstrate against nuclear power plants.

In Germany for example. around 1 million people were joining the demonstrations against nuclear power plants and demanding them to be switched off.

Also lots of people in Spain demonstrated against nuclear power plants in the majority of cities.

In Italy, thousands of people also joined the demonstrations.

In France - the country with most nuclear power plants - people gathered around the Eiffel Tower to do the same (only 300 though).

In the UK people demonstrated as well - however against tax cuts. Currently Tories in the UK do not want to switch of nuclear power plants - in fact they are even planning to build new ones - now in 2011.

Rolling Eyes

What do you think? Do we need nuclear power plants?

In my humnble opinion I think it would be wiser to use 25% less electricity and do without nuclear power plants and all the toxic waste you need to lock away for thousands of years.

Of course, the danger is a lot bigger in areas with earthquakes such as Japan - however human errors are the biggest danger. The probability of a plane hitting a nuclear power plant is small - however I don't think it is necessary to take such a big risk with there is plenty of other solutions to generate electricity - especially as there is a lot of room for saving electricity that is just wasted.

 

28.03.2011, 21:55 quote

omark1975
Joined: 01 Feb 2009 Posts: 128 Location: United Kingdom, England, London
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god wrote:

What do you think? Do we need nuclear power plants?

In my humnble opinion I think it would be wiser to use 25% less electricity and do without nuclear power plants and all the toxic waste you need to lock away for thousands of years.

Of course, the danger is a lot bigger in areas with earthquakes such as Japan - however human errors are the biggest danger. The probability of a plane hitting a nuclear power plant is small - however I don't think it is necessary to take such a big risk with there is plenty of other solutions to generate electricity - especially as there is a lot of room for saving electricity that is just wasted.


One problem is that energy needs are likely to grow in the future, especially as more countries become industralised. Any cleaner energy sources will have to be comparable with what we currently have- mainly coal follwed by gas and then nuclear.

If we start cutting down on coal power generation at the same time as the world's supply of natural gas falls or becomes insecure, nuclear becomes the next best large scale energy source- and even that my not be sufficient to fill the gap.

Combine the increased demand for electricity with the reduced supply of energy sources and it becomes harder to argue against nuclear. Even if we reduce our consumption, it is likely that those savings will be gobbled up by the increase in demand from developing countries.

Of course, a lot of resources are going into cleaner and renewable energy research and technology, but scalable solutions still seem far away

 

29.03.2011, 05:46 quote

god
Joined: 30 May 2006 Posts: 752
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The UK will certainly not produce electricity for developing countries. So you can not argue with that.

Currently electricity from nuclear plants is only 20% in the UK - and 20% is something that could even be saved by wasting less electricity especially in the public sector and in public buildings and by replacing some old machines in factories.

- overall population in Europe is decreasing, not increasing (in the UK it is more or less stable)

- around 50% (?) of the electricity is lost during transportation -> so small plants (e.g. water energy, wind energy, solar panels) would also help to avoid transporting electricity over long distances

- Norway has more electriciy that it can consume due to the many waterfalls - so the UK could also buy environmentally friendly and zero carbon electricity from Norway which would also totally covery the 20% from nuclear plants

 

29.03.2011, 13:31 quote

scottoh
Joined: 06 Nov 2008 Posts: 283 Location: United Kingdom, England, Surrey
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Personally I don't see why the money being invested in new nuclear power plants could not be invested instead into renewable energy. Especially hydro electricity, we have plenty of rivers and lakes in this country to make that work, not to mention many hundreds of miles of coast for wind farms.

Perhaps seeing the disaster in Japan recently has made people more aware of just how vulnerable we all are to nuclear contamination in the case of accidents and wars. A nuclear power station is a sitting duck for any country wanting to create as much impact as possible in a bombing raid against another country.

 

08.06.2011, 18:03 quote

kingstuart
kingstuart Joined: 16 Nov 2007 Posts: 23 Location: United Kingdom, England, East Yorkshire
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scottoh wrote:
Personally I don't see why the money being invested in new nuclear power plants could not be invested instead into renewable energy. Especially hydro electricity, we have plenty of rivers and lakes in this country to make that work, not to mention many hundreds of miles of coast for wind farms.

Perhaps seeing the disaster in Japan recently has made people more aware of just how vulnerable we all are to nuclear contamination in the case of accidents and wars. A nuclear power station is a sitting duck for any country wanting to create as much impact as possible in a bombing raid against another country.


More people die building wind farms than nuclear power has killed.

 

08.06.2011, 18:21 quote

zacktelstar
zacktelstar Joined: 15 Feb 2009 Posts: 838 Location: United Kingdom, Scotland, Edinburgh
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Data based on Belarus national cancer statistics, predicts approximately 270,000 cancers and 93,000 fatal cancer cases caused by Chernobyl alone. The fact the Russia has never disclosed the cancer statistics of other Soviet era disasters: such as the Muyrak reactor explosion which exposed 124,000 people to medium and high levels of radiation, or the Chelyabinsk nuclear waste disaster - surely, I would think, accounts for accidents involving wind farm construction?
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08.06.2011, 21:48 quote

cmiso

kingstuart wrote:
More people die building wind farms than nuclear power has killed.


Are we building them all in Libya, Iraq, and Afghanistan?

 

09.06.2011, 21:17 quote

kingstuart
kingstuart Joined: 16 Nov 2007 Posts: 23 Location: United Kingdom, England, East Yorkshire
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zacktelstar wrote:
Data based on Belarus national cancer statistics, predicts approximately 270,000 cancers and 93,000 fatal cancer cases caused by Chernobyl alone. The fact the Russia has never disclosed the cancer statistics of other Soviet era disasters: such as the Muyrak reactor explosion which exposed 124,000 people to medium and high levels of radiation, or the Chelyabinsk nuclear waste disaster - surely, I would think, accounts for accidents involving wind farm construction?


Deaths in America from wind power about 1,000
Deaths in America from Nuclear power about 3

Deaths per TWH globally:
Wind 0.15
Nuclear 0.04

 

09.06.2011, 23:06 quote

trowser
trowser Joined: 25 May 2011 Posts: 44 Location: United Kingdom, ,
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I want to see more reactors in the end run its not a power source were going to run out of and is much more enviromentially friendly that any of the alternatives.

Yes that includes wind power and wave power and all the so called green renewables because you burn more coal and produce more greenhouse gasses producing the things than they save in thier lifetime.

Once you had a reactor in place it can run nigh on forever producing energy so its only one cost, fine you have a big of radiation but you can bury that and you get little waste in comparision to everything else

Nice controversial topic I like it Smile

 

10.06.2011, 17:37 quote

scottoh
Joined: 06 Nov 2008 Posts: 283 Location: United Kingdom, England, Surrey
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kingstuart wrote:
scottoh wrote:
Personally I don't see why the money being invested in new nuclear power plants could not be invested instead into renewable energy. Especially hydro electricity, we have plenty of rivers and lakes in this country to make that work, not to mention many hundreds of miles of coast for wind farms.

Perhaps seeing the disaster in Japan recently has made people more aware of just how vulnerable we all are to nuclear contamination in the case of accidents and wars. A nuclear power station is a sitting duck for any country wanting to create as much impact as possible in a bombing raid against another country.


More people die building wind farms than nuclear power has killed.


That might depend on where you get your statistics from. However, perhaps the building of the nuclear reactors is not the most dangerous bit...
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10.06.2011, 17:43 quote

kingstuart
kingstuart Joined: 16 Nov 2007 Posts: 23 Location: United Kingdom, England, East Yorkshire
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scottoh wrote:

That might depend on where you get your statistics from. However, perhaps the building of the nuclear reactors is not the most dangerous bit...


And you have alternative statistics?

 

10.06.2011, 17:51 quote

kingstuart
kingstuart Joined: 16 Nov 2007 Posts: 23 Location: United Kingdom, England, East Yorkshire
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trowser wrote:
I want to see more reactors in the end run its not a power source were going to run out of and is much more enviromentially friendly that any of the alternatives.

Yes that includes wind power and wave power and all the so called green renewables because you burn more coal and produce more greenhouse gasses producing the things than they save in thier lifetime.

Once you had a reactor in place it can run nigh on forever producing energy so its only one cost, fine you have a big of radiation but you can bury that and you get little waste in comparision to everything else

Nice controversial topic I like it Smile


There is a couple of hundred years or so supplies of reactor material currently, that isn't to say more will be found.

I think we need a much bigger push to green energy, but the technology is currently feasible to move towards it as quickly as many think we should.

Say we stick a million wind turbines across the UK, sure it might provide enough energy but are there other costs? Wind and tidal both take energy out of the system, could there be a point when wind farms will start to effect weather cycles? Hydro-electric has it's downfalls, it alters the flow of rivers, disrupts migrations of fish etc. But as long as it's not nuclear it's fine.........

 

11.06.2011, 00:02 quote

handsel
handsel Joined: 18 Mar 2009 Posts: 2254 Location: United Kingdom, England, West Midlands
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There's my idea...
The average unused area inside the average motorway roundabout is approx. 2 acres. I'd have all those dish-shaped and fitted with solar panels.
Say I did about 300 roundabouts = 600 acres of panels.
Any motorway side panels and central reservation areas that get light most of the day, I'd have fitted with solar panels.
Say I did the same amount as above, but it could be more I suspect.
So, 1200 acres of solar panels, so far...
Then I'm going to panel all the railways and the canals and some of the remoter beach or cliff areas and say I get twice the above = 2400 acres.
With the 1200 I already have, I'd have 3600 acres in total.
Now, here's what I don't know...
How much electricity am I generating, with all this?
(When the sun shines!)
How much approx. of the current UK usage would it make up?
(Yesterday we used just under 30Gigawatt.)
How much would it cost me to do it?
When would I start making my millions? Razz
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